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px166bajaj
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ATF is for hydraulic transmissions. The Auto Transmissions on these bikes are completely mechanical. With the exception of a little grease in the bearings, they don't need lubrication.

The final drive gearbox needs either gear oil or multigrade. (Whatever the manufacturer recommends)

People from all around the world come to this site for info. It's important that any info provided is accurate.



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csrmel



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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 12:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

have any of you guys been inside an auto trans before? it literally has gears with teeth just like a manual transmission. I cant fathom why it is so difficult for you to comprehend that.

not only that, but front wheel drive auto's have differentials, output shafts and sliding ring and pinions, all which are lubed by the auto trans fluid. if atf can do that, it can surely handle a tiny scooter trans.

someone else said atf isnt an oil or something silly like that. its a hydraulic fluid and not an oil? whats the difference between a fluid and an oil? if the oil flows downhill, its a fluid. someone tried to differentiate that atf is meant for hydraulics only. tell that to the ring and pinion in my Mitsubishi car which is lubed by atf. I'm not too concerned with who said what exactly. but its foolish to let out info without knowing what you are talking about. a real hydraulic only type of fluid is typically little more than plain iso 32 or 64 oil splashed with a bit of aw and anti foam additives.

atf is formulated with additives to deal with the gears(with teeth as someone else noted) , ball bearings, needle bearings, shafts and sliding components of a car transmission as well as differentials and axles where specified. as well as the aforementioned anti foam and aw adds. and yes auto trans have a pump and some hydraulic parts. but how you think those hydraulic parts get turned? the gears and bearings which connect them to the motor!


lots of manual transmissions spec atf. the venerable mazda rx7 of the early 90's and maybe the late 80's speced atf for the trans. so did / do a lot of other cars. even some 2 stroke dirt bikes gearboxes spec atf. my own personal banshee 350 6 speed runs on atf in the gearbox and nothing else. my fathers ford bronco specs atf in the 4 wheel drive reduction box bolted to the end of the transmission. there are no hydraulics in ANY of the vehicles I just mentioned. purely gears and teeth baby.

when you switch the gy6 trans to atf, you can notice the rear wheel becomes easier to turn by hand compared to gear oil or motor oil. when actually running the motor, it reduces parasitic drag. and my kids been beating the snot out of this gy6 since its installed in an atv and goes through dirt water and mud as well as high speed trails (sort of high speed) there has been no issues whatsoever with the gearbox using atf.

so I have offered up reasonable evidence that atf can be used in non hydraulic applications.

I offered up trial by fire on my own equipment. I run atf in the gearbox of my own gy6 and have never had in issue.

short of providing a warranty for each one of you. that is all I can do. I cant force anyone to run atf. by all means if you are not comfortable doing it then dont. but for those who are willing to, the benefits are numerous, espically in cold weather when that gearbox oil is as thick as butter and the atf is still flowing. try the freezer test. put a quart of atf, 80w90 and some 10w30 or 15w40 in the freezer until they reach 0c. pull them out and see which one flows the best. or actually see which one(s) still flow at ALL.

and with that I respectfully bow out of the subject. nothing more to say.


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Fox



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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 1:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can see you point csrmel. My question is why do rear wheel drive cars and trucks with automatic transmissions use gear oil in the differential if trans fluid is better?

I had a Hyundai with a manual transmission and the service manual said to use gear oil in it.

I think that the thicker gear oil provides a better "cushion" between the gear teeth than trans fluid will. That's just my gut feeling and is not based on any research I did.


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larry8



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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The gist of the matter is that gearboxes are designed to run on gear oil not ATF. Car auto trans are designed to run on ATF. The manufacturers engineers consult with the oil companies engineers to design the trannies for a specific gear oil or ATF. Those engineers are much better qualified to spec out the type of oil or fluid to use as they have done the research.
Try putting gear oil in your automatic transmission and see if it will work.

I service industrial gearboxes for the last 40 or so years and have repaired a lot that had ATF in them by someones recommendation. After the repair I recommended gear oil and they dont have a problem after that. I have discussed the use of ATF in gearboxes with oil engineers and absolutely none will recommend using it.



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px166bajaj
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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

larry8 wrote:
The gist of the matter is that gearboxes are designed to run on gear oil not ATF..... The manufacturers engineers consult with the oil companies engineers to design the trannies for a specific gear oil or ATF. Those engineers are much better qualified to spec out the type of oil or fluid to use as they have done the research.



Yep



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lcarfizz



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 6:13 pm    Post subject: Can't find the drain plug or filler hole Reply with quote

I recently got a MC-54-250 and the gearbox is different than is shown in the manual or from other similar scooters for that matter. If anyone wants to look at it, here is the link to a picture that is exactly like mine.

http://store.oohla.com/storefiles/terminatorscooter//upload/imagemanager/557/1176875388298.jpg[/code]

Can anyone shed light?

Lou


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larry8



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 6:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Can't find the drain plug or filler hole Reply with quote

lcarfizz wrote:
I recently got a MC-54-250 and the gearbox is different than is shown in the manual or from other similar scooters for that matter. If anyone wants to look at it, here is the link to a picture that is exactly like mine.

http://store.oohla.com/storefiles/terminatorscooter//upload/imagemanager/557/1176875388298.jpg[/code]

Can anyone shed light?

Lou


It's similar to all scooters in that it takes an oil to function correctly. Change the oil that came with it for a good synthetic gear oil.



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lcarfizz



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Larry8 - Thanks for the reply. I forgot to emphasize that I can't find the fill hole or the drain plug. The other Roketa scooters have a rounded end that covers the belt and drive. The one I have has a tapered end and it looks like the only way to get at the plug is to remove the crankcase. I'm hoping that is not the case. I did find a good 90 weight Suzuki oil in a plastic bottle with an eyedropper type end so I'm good in that department.

I am so glad this site is here Smile


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larry8



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PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some scoots like my RX had the fill and drain plugs way on the bottom. I had to look underneath to find them.



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SteveG



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:01 pm    Post subject: oil and gear oil Reply with quote

I will be changing my oil and gear oil soon and will use amsoil motor cycle 10 40 oil and 75 90 gear oil, I hear that is the best to use in these scooters


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clodius



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PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just changed the gear oil on my scooter. I used 110ml of 1Mobil Mobilube HD SAE 80w90. 900 ml to go Smile


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timpo1981



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could only find 10w40 scooter trans oil in halfords. Will it be ok to use in BT49QT-9?

Cheers



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larry8



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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

timpo1981 wrote:
Could only find 10w40 scooter trans oil in halfords. Will it be ok to use in BT49QT-9?

Cheers



It really should say "for gearbox or geared transmissions" or something like that on the bottle. A good engine oil will do the job too. 75-90 gear oil is about the same viscosity as 30 weight motor oil, so that 10w40 should be OK if you can't find straight "gear oil".



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ragnarok



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 12:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

clarification: should the oil be at the threads with the scoot laying on its side, or standing up?


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Fox



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PostPosted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The oil level is to the hole with the scooter standing straight up. It's easier to get the oil in the hole if you lean it against a wall to the right. After you fill it a few times, you will get a "feel" for how much oil to use.






Last edited by Fox on Sat Jun 14, 2008 12:46 am; edited 2 times in total
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