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scooterfanatic



Joined: 27 Oct 2007
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Location: Northumberland, UK

PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2007 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice one guys thanks



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mi17dy



Joined: 25 Jan 2008
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Location: Los Angeles

PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2008 11:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow those pics show fancy tubings. My gear oil comes with a little spout so I just open and squeeze. By the way, I ALWAYS use motorcycle gear oils. I use Honda brand for engine AND gear oil. That's cuz my engine is a honda replica, and only the best for my baby. I would not recommend using regular engine oil, or even car engine oil.... I'm sure they make different types of oils for a reason!
Here's a video I made showing me changing engine, then transmission gear oils. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2fSVNYZsSc Hope that helps!


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frainey



Joined: 10 Dec 2006
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Location: Lancashire

PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2008 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like my bike as its a cg125 copy so the engine oil also lubricates the gears too!
Thats why I'm prepared to spend 11 a litre for it.



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Fox



Joined: 05 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2008 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mi17dy wrote:
By the way, I ALWAYS use motorcycle gear oils. I use Honda brand for engine AND gear oil. That's cuz my engine is a honda replica, and only the best for my baby. I would not recommend using regular engine oil, or even car engine oil.... I'm sure they make different types of oils for a reason!


I say that it's virtually the same motor/gear oil in a package that says "Formulated for motorcycles" on it. They can do this because it IS good for motorcycles, but it's also good for cars and trucks, they just omit that part so you think it's special.. Rolling Eyes

It's a marketing ploy so they can charge you more for the same thing. They create a false sense in your mind that you are getting a superior product because it says "Honda" on it. I bet the bottles are made by one company who ships them to another location where the oil is placed into the bottle, and Honda buys them cheaply all the while having nothing to do with it and then commands a high price for it.

Another example of this sort of thing is canned vegetables. Peas for example: The store has a variety of brands that range in price. Then the store will usually have it's own brand which cost less that the higher priced brand,. but in reality, it is the same can from the same cannery with a different label. This way the factory caters to all demographics and the more wealthy think they have a superior can of peas. $$$$ Idea


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TheDarkCutlass



Joined: 04 Jan 2008
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Location: Virginia Beach, VA

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fox wrote:

I say that it's virtually the same motor/gear oil in a package that says "Formulated for motorcycles" on it. They can do this because it IS good for motorcycles, but it's also good for cars and trucks, they just omit that part so you think it's special.. Rolling Eyes

It's a marketing ploy so they can charge you more for the same thing. They create a false sense in your mind that you are getting a superior product because it says "Honda" on it. I bet the bottles are made by one company who ships them to another location where the oil is placed into the bottle, and Honda buys them cheaply all the while having nothing to do with it and then commands a high price for it.

Another example of this sort of thing is canned vegetables. Peas for example: The store has a variety of brands that range in price. Then the store will usually have it's own brand which cost less that the higher priced brand,. but in reality, it is the same can from the same cannery with a different label. This way the factory caters to all demographics and the more wealthy think they have a superior can of peas. $$$$ Idea


Heres another example:

Go down to your local hardware store, find the "Liquid Nail" adhesive (the ones in the caulking tubes). Now look at all the varieties, of "Liquid Nail"...ex "Heavy Duty" "Stair Tread" "Cove Base"... most of them are identicle except for the outside label!




Last edited by TheDarkCutlass on Mon Jan 28, 2008 8:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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px166bajaj
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Joined: 09 Oct 2006
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Location: Sevenoaks Kent (Er, that's UK!)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheDarkCutlass wrote:
Heres another example:

Go down to your local hardware store, find the "Liquid Nail" adhesive (the ones in the caulking tubes). No look at all the varieties, most of them are identicle except for the outside label!


Here's another example. Go into your bathroom and look at every product. Notice that every single shampoo/conditioner/dandruff product etc etc etc contains Sodium Laureth Sulphate, whatever the brand.

They are all the same.



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ceethreepio



Joined: 29 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, new to this. My daughter has just started scootering so thought this would be a good place for a look round, learn a bit, etc.

Oil subject interesting. Without getting too anal there can and should be some differences in what appears to be the same oil for a car/bike - mostly due to a collection of additives called friction modifiers, there to work with motorcycle (wet) clutches.

Using ATF in place of gear oil, in this instance of constantly variable transmissions will cause no harm.

Cheers


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TheDarkCutlass



Joined: 04 Jan 2008
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Location: Virginia Beach, VA

PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2008 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ceethreepio wrote:

Using ATF in place of gear oil, in this instance of constantly variable transmissions will cause no harm.

Cheers


the CVT on these scooters is a Dry System, no fluid involved. This oil actually should almost be called Differential Oil, or Final Drive Oil, as that is what it is put in, the Final Drive of the drivetrain, not the transmission. Would you put ATF fluid in a differential? I think not.


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einstein1984



Joined: 22 Oct 2007
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Location: Romania, Bucharest

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 4:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just changed mine, at 250 km. The bolts are 10 mm, not 11 and I made a hell of a mess.
First of all they were very tight and I needed a bigger socket handle to undo them. I first removed the fill bolt (I thought they need some air to go in so it could drain better), but because the thing was filled on the side and not upright, some oil came out, like 20 ml.
I then removed the drain bolt, also very tight. Drained it, put the drain back in, tighned it and then the fill bolt.... which for some strange reason does not want to tighten. It's not loose, it has a bit of friction, but it wil just turn around however much I try it. What happened?



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jdg



Joined: 13 Oct 2007
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Location: Worcester

PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2008 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This was my first oil change for the transmission. My daughters bike is a Lifan scooter, and the question is how much oil was needed was given by it being embossed on the casing 0.12 l. I used a 60 ml syringe with the bike on it's main stand with little wastage running from it. What had come out afer a 5 mile run was reminiscent of what our local chippie might discard!


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Tribal-Wolf



Joined: 03 Mar 2008
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Location: Hessle, East Yorkshire

PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 8:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just thought I would mention this. Synthetic gear oil is by far the best thing to put in a transmission as it will increase the life, however Honda (this motors original creator) always recommended engine oil in their car transmissions years ago even in the big Rover 800 manual boxs. Saying that after having owned varoius Honda cars in the past, 75 90 syn gear oil improved the change/noise/drivability of those cars when changed from the 'recommended' engine oil.

So I would vote for the synth gear oil.


*GM (vauxhall etc) used ATF in manual boxes on cars for a while and they knocked out bearings frequently*

Sorry for rambling Icon_lol5


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csrmel



Joined: 10 May 2008
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PostPosted: Mon May 12, 2008 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

automatic car transmissions have ball bearings, plain baerings, gears, shafts and seals just like these little scooter gearboxes do. automatic trans are actually more complex and intricate since they have valves and pumps to deal with as well as clutch packs. if atf can lubricate a cars transmission with no problems, it can certainly lube these little low power gearboxes with ease.

think about it. an automatic trans has to deal with horsepower ranging from 50-1000 depending on the car. if it can cope with that it then can deal with the sub 10hp motors in these scoots with ease.

also, an automatic trans fluid like dodge atf+4 is a synthetic, costs about $4 a quart. auto trans fluid also has roughly the viscosity of a 5w20 motor oil. so using atf should decrease drag in the gearbox allowing for quicker acceleration and more top speed because of less parasitic drag.

1 quart of the fluid should last for quite a few oil changes in a chinese scoot gearbox.


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einstein1984



Joined: 22 Oct 2007
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Location: Romania, Bucharest

PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's bullshit. ATF should not be use in a scooter transmission, period. Manual transmission oil (hypoid gear oil) is the best thing for the job.
Transmission oil's job is not to lubricate only the bearings (they could have use dsealed bearing for that) but to lubricate the teeth of the cogs. Any mechanichal engineer could tell you that (and this one is doing just that).



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Bis



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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Although I can see benifits of using ATF in the short term I wouldn't recommend it.

To me it is quite simple:

Engine oil in your engine.
Transmission/gear oil in your transmission.
ATF in you cars automatic transmission.

'The reason the tablets aren't getting rid of your headache, it prenounced An-el-geic'



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larry8



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PostPosted: Tue May 13, 2008 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This subject of using ATF in the scooter trans has been written up before but bears repeating.
ATF is a hydraulic FLUID - NOT an oil. It has very little lubricating properties and the viscosity is very thin. Just what you need in a complex automotive automatic transmission.
However it is NOT recommended for manual transmissions, differentials, or (scooter) gearboxes (which is what we have in the scooters). These devices are "gearboxes", and as such the gears need the properties of "gear" oil, which are anti-wear additives like phosphorus or the like. Gears also need thicker oil to reduce and distribute the contact pressure between the gear teeth, which is why it is thicker than motor oil or ATF.
The use of ATF in gearboxes WILL shorten the life of any gearbox.



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