Chinese Scooter Club

JimmyP · Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:33 pm Bit of a dilemma...

I've never owned a scooter/bike before and am considering getting one simply for the daily 18-mile commute. I've done a bit of research (including browsing this forum) and like the retro look of the Tamoretti/Baron/Jinlun/Znen Tommy style scooters.

However, I've been given the somewhat expected "don't buy a Chinese bike - they're cr@p" line from two mates - one of whom is a serious biker. He hasn't got a problem with scooters (as it's horses for courses, like he said) but he was adamant that their build quality - and even the type of steel used - is far inferior to those used by the well-known Japanese and German manufacturers.

Now I could have maybe understood this argument several years ago when the first imports hit the UK but does it still stand now? I'm sure I read somewhere that certain manufacturers in Chine have stepped up and are producing good quality scooters.

I appreciate that this is a Chinese scooter forum so I'm expecting a certain bias ( :D ) but I would appreciate your views anyway.

Thanks.

halley · Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:51 pm

Since this forum has a lot of emphasis on helping each other fix problems with Chinese scooters, one could take the impression that they're all "cr@p." No, they're not all junk, but there are two factors: (1) they seem to be more inconsistent in build quality, and (2) some of the few scooter shops out there don't handle the Chinese bikes, so it's all do-it-yourself.

As has been discussed recently, there's one institute in China that does the engineering work. They've adapted Honda designs, and probably these adaptations are to make the designs more hospitable to a range of materials and manufacturing conditions. The tolerances may be looser. Then there are many industrial manufacturers which "buy" these designs and churn out parts.

Honda isn't a franchise, it's a single company. The engineers know the manufacturing conditions completely. The manufacturers are all working by one rulebook. Since Honda also manages their sales channel, the retailers are still Honda, you can say that they make a product that is "ready to ride."

China scooter products are like independently-owned franchise outlets. They have room to "differentiate" themselves, and some choose to pump them out fast and cheap, and others choose to pump them out slightly slower and more carefully. They also are making a product that is "ready to ship" not "ready to ride."

The retailer seems to make a big difference when the product comes out so inconsistently. The general wisdom is to get the bike off the boat, replace all the fluids and spark plug, check all the hoses, tighten everything. If your retailer in the US or UK does all that well, then you'll probably ride your scooter for many trouble-free years. If not, then you're trying to ride on a bike that's still just "ready to ship" not "ready to ride."

JimmyP · Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:57 pm

Cheers Ed - I appreciate that bit of background about the industry as I wasn't aware of exactly how it worked.

Thanks.

halley · Wed Jul 23, 2008 12:59 pm

One other small observation I'll make. It seems that the less expensive a bike is sold, the less care some people take with their bike. Since a Chinese scooter is a fourth to a half of a Vespa or Honda, that leads to some... shall we say... exuberances of youth. Fewer riders are likely to run a $4000 bike in the same rough conditions and ways than would push a $800 bike to the limit.

JimmyP · Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:02 pm

That's a valid point that I hadn't really considered.

As a 36-year old bloke I don't think I fall into that category but I have still got a bit of exuberance left in me!

millerKANSAS · Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:05 pm

I find the Chines scoots to be fair quality for the price. I own two chines scooter's, one for me and one for my wife. One of them has had several small problems but all were easy to fix.

For me, it all came down to the price. I can't afford the high dollar scoots.
I figure my scooter will pay for itself in less than 8 months in gas savings alone. The high dollar scoots would have a much longer payback time.

The Chines scooters may have some issues but you can find most parts on the internet easily and this is a great forum to find help. I find them to be well worth the money I paid for them.

JimmyP · Wed Jul 23, 2008 1:14 pm

millerKANSAS - that's exactly why I'm considering getting one. With petrol prices at £1.16 per litre (I think that works out to be over $8.50 per US gallon) and road tax currently at £190pa going up to £280pa next year - a scooter really does make sense.

Like you said, the £900 which it costs for a new scooter OTR will effectively be saved within 2 years compared to using a car.

I'd also be willing to get my hands dirty and attempt my own servicing (to a certain degree) which I understand is pretty much required with some of the scooters!

Thanks for your views.

Yellow Scooter · Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:41 pm

A lot of thes 'crap' problems are completly avoidable. It comes down to the care used in the PDI, and assembly, as well as personal inspection by the end consumer.
These bikes best serve those of us that like to do their own maintenance and repairs and who also like to tinker. There are plenty of parts outlets out there for these machines. Most places will consolidate their parts list under 'GY6 &/or clones' and not nessicerily by any particular brand name.
The hands-off folks that take their bikes to the shop for every squeak n rattle, will likely not have any luck with these machines, and ultimatly will not have one kind word to say about any of them.

Stanislavs1 · Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:47 pm

I say, if you just ride it and don't mess around with it too much, it's gonna serve you all your life. :lol:

larry8 · Wed Jul 23, 2008 4:57 pm

Stanislavs1 wrote: I say, if you just ride it and don't mess around with it too much, it's gonna serve you all your life. :lol:

That is, if you don't live very long.

Most Chinese scoots will last for 10 years if cared for properly. It's true that they wont last as long as the Italian or Jap scoots and they have a low resale value. Some consider them to be "throw aways" after a few years.

millerKANSAS · Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:25 pm

Here in the US the market is exploding for scooters. Even the Chines scooters are holding there value. I ran my 50cc SunL scooter for 9 months and sold it for a price that was $25.00 more than I paid for it.

I try to take good care of my scooters and anticipate they will serve us well for a long time.

The Chines scooters are worth a try. I am glad I took the chance on buying one.

The expensive brands have their problems too. I met a gentleman at a fast food restaurant who was driving a big new Suzuki Burgman. I mentioned to him that it was a sharp looking scooter and he remarked that "yea now, but last week it was all in pieces at the dealers because the transmission went out." I bet his repair bill was close to the price of my scooter.

JimmyP · Thu Jul 24, 2008 7:13 am

Cheers guys - really appreciate your views.

Now I need to know if there's any difference between the likes of Znen, Tamoretti, Jinlun, etc or are they pretty much the same as far as build quality and reliability (a cleverly crafted way of asking which retro one I should go for!).